Ben Lerner is not known for freestyling. He's known for writing novels (also poems). But as a kid growing up in Topeka, Ben was deep in a world of male anger—anger that found outlets in debate championships, drunken fistfights, and, yes, also white-guy rap battles. And while Ben was growing up, his mom, Harriet Lerner, was navigating a world of anger, too. In this episode, Ben and Harriet talk about how their family's life shaped Ben's new novel, The Topeka School. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices