Rachel and Simon speak to Francesca Main, publisher of Phoenix Books, an imprint of the Orion Publishing Group which in turn is part of Hachette. She started her career at Penguin, first in the rights department and then as an editorial assistant at Hamish Hamilton; she then spent four years as a commissioning editor at Simon & Schuster. She joined Picador as editorial director in 2011 and launched the careers of writers including Adam Kay, Cathy Rentzenbrink and Jessie Burton. In 2015 Francesca was named Editor of the Year at the Bookseller Industry Awards. In 2020 she moved to Orion to launch her own imprint, Phoenix, which she has said will be a destination "for books you can't put down and can't forget". We spoke to Francesca about her experience working at Penguin, Simon & Schuster and Picador, about publishing smash hits such as "The Miniaturist" and "This Is Going to Hurt", and about setting up Phoenix Books.

This episode of Always Take Notes is sponsored by Curtis Brown Creative. Go to www.curtisbrowncreative.co.uk to find out more about their creative writing courses. Use code ATN20 for £20 off the full price of any four-, five, six- or ten-week online course.

You can find us online at ⁠alwaystakenotes.com⁠, on Twitter @takenotesalways and on Instagram @alwaystakenotes. Our crowdfunding page is ⁠patreon.com/alwaystakenotes⁠. Always Take Notes is presented by Simon Akam and Rachel Lloyd, and produced by Artemis Irvine. Our music is by Jessica Dannheisser and our logo was designed by James Edgar.