We've talked about pilots before on Making the Sausage, but we haven't really talked about what it's like to be someone who's still trying to get your first one off the ground. Nick is one of those people, and he's enlisted his friend and fellow writer Josh Chesler to join him for a candid conversation about doing the real work of writing and marketing yourself, getting meetings, celebrating the successes and weathering the frustrations, and staying motivated through all of it.  SHOW NOTES  The Applicant (Josh's short film with co-director/producer/star Paul Connor) Chasing Ghosts (the movie Josh wrote) Links to TV show biblesLearn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices