Welcome to episode 24 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.

In this episode, the presenters, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and journalist Jo Confino, talk about how to find peace in ourselves and to encourage peace in the world during times of war. They remember Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh, who himself  lived through a conflict – the Vietnam War – yet found a way to peace, and to become an activist for transformation.

They also discuss inherited war traumas; the importance of maintaining compassion and balance during these times; the limits of compassion; going beyond our ‘roles’ and ‘labels’; chanelling anger; practicing when we feel ‘on the edge’; racism and discrimination; coming back to our humanity; cultivating love, peace, and nonviolence,  every day. And: can we bear arms without hatred? 

Brother Phap Huu shares his own family’s experience of the war in Vietnam and, subsequently, as refugees; Thay’s creation of a nonviolent movement in wartime; and surprising insights from a retreat for Palestinians and Israelis in Plum Village.He also delves into recognizing the thoughts that manifest during wartime; taking refuge in the energy and wisdom of the practice; coming back to our human nature during hard times; nonviolence as a way, not a tool; grounding and moderation; becoming a refuge for those who are suffering; teaching the awareness of interbeing; and how to not drown in our own despair.

Jo considers the difficulty of transforming our feelings about the war through practice (such as not becoming consumed by the news, not taking sides, being equanimous); inherited war trauma; the transformational power of vulnerability; and the perils of hierarchies.

The episode ends with a chant on peace recited by Brother Phap Huu.

Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/

And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ 

With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ 

List of resources 

‘The Five Earth Touchings’https://plumvillage.org/key-practice-texts/the-five-earth-touchings/Thich Nhat Hanh On…: ‘Peace between Palestinians and Israelis’https://plumvillage.org/articles/peace-between-palestinians-and-israelis/Sister Chan Khonghttps://plumvillage.org/about/sister-chan-khong/ 

Avalokiteśvarahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avalokite%C5%9Bvara 

Martin Luther King Jr.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Luther_King_Jr. 

Countdown Summithttps://countdown.ted.com/events 

Sutras: ‘Discourse on the 5 Ways of Putting an End to Anger’https://plumvillage.org/library/sutras/discourse-on-the-five-ways-of-putting-an-end-to-anger/

Quotes

“When there’s war, we have to face the beast of war, and that is violence, that is hatred, discrimination, greed, and death.”

“Wherever there is darkness, light is also there. And this is the deep teaching in Buddhism: nonduality. It’s very easy to get caught in the right and the left, the above and the below, the good and the bad, the dark and the light. It doesn’t mean that we ignore it, but we know that if there is the right, there is also the left. If there is war, there is peace somewhere.”

“Man is not our enemy. It is ignorance, it is fear, it is destruction.”

“Nonviolence is not a tool. Nonviolence is a way.”

“We believe in using deep listening and compassionate speech for reconciliation, as a way forward instead of using the army; the army, the guns, the bombs, it doesn’t bring peace.” 

“You have to have the peace inside of you in order for the peace outside to manifest.”

“Grounding is very important at this time. You can be a refuge for the ones who are suffering. The people who are suffering are also seeking stability. So, if we as humans, if we as practitioners have that stability, that is also an offering to the chaos that is happening right now.” 

“Compassion needs to be nourished. We can be depleted of this understanding and this energy, this source of acceptance, and this source of embracing. One of the teachings that was given to us is to still find the simple joy in daily life. And I think this was Thay’s antidote in the war: to still see the wonders of life, still have time to sing a song. And Thay wrote a lot of peace poems during that time, to channel in the miracle of life.”

“Thay’s community would establish days of mindfulness, and this is why we have a tradition of Thursdays and Sundays as days of mindfulness, because social workers during the Vietnam War needed a day where they didn’t talk about the war. They talked about their deepest aspiration, they talked about their dreams; it’s a way to balance the destruction and the suffering that is there.”

“When you have real love and compassion, it is limitless. And that can be a source of teaching, a source of refuge, a source of inspiration, a source of hope for many people.”

“May I be peaceful, light, and happy, in body and in mind. May I be free and safe from accidents. May I be free from anger, unwholesome states of mind, and worries. May I know how to look at myself with the eyes of understanding and love. May I be able to recognize and touch the seeds of joy and happiness in myself. May I not be caught in a state of indifference or be caught in the extremes of attachment or aversion. May you be peaceful, light, and happy, in body and in mind. May you be free and safe from accidents. May you be free from anger, unwholesome states of mind, and worries. May you know how to look at yourself with the eyes of understanding and love. May you not be caught in a state of indifference or be caught in the extremes.” 

“Compassion gives you a source of energy that gives you no fear, and sometimes that compassion can become your barrier, your protector.”

“War does not lead to peace; peace is the way.” 

“Buddhism is really teaching us to be human again, to see each other without a label, without a hierarchy of, ‘Yyou are the boss, I am the servant, you are a soldier.’ Because if we remove all of that and we ask everyone to remove all of that we can ask each other, ‘What is it that we deeply want?’”

“The thing about humanity is that we always repeat the same mistakes, even from the Buddha’s time. The Buddha left his responsibility and his inheritance to be a king because his deepest desire was, ‘That doesn’t bring me true happiness, ruling a nation. What brings me true happiness is the cessation of suffering, is the nourishment of understanding, is the insight of love and compassion, that all blood is red, all of our tears are salty.’ And the Buddha came from the caste system in his country, which discriminated a lot, and he wanted to break free from that. So we may say we live in a free country, but I think there are many barriers.”

“All of us are responsible for either creating a sense of suffering, or pain, or abuse. In every one of our thoughts and actions, we can either be sowing the seeds of hope, love, compassion, and deep listening, or we can be judging, belittling, and taking advantage of people. We are all individually responsible for the collective consciousness that leads to wars.”

“Be the peace you want to see.”