How do you show up in relationships? Jim Zartman is a certified Enneagram teacher, a former Midwest megachurch producer, a father, husband, and the Co-Founder of The Art of Growth, a top-rated Enneagram podcast and company of the same name. He also happens to be one of Laura’s best friends. Laura brought Jim on to break down the three types of relational energy we tend to inhabit, how each can cause pain and dysfunction in our relationships, and the magical fourth type, or “with” energy, that he believes is the path through to peace. Jim’s the first to tell you that he doesn’t have the answers, but he’s a hell of an example of how awesome the process of growing up can be. Get to know Jim better: You can connect with him through his site or you can reach him and the entire team at The Art of Growth. Tell Me Something True is a 100% independent podcast. There are no corporations or advertisers backing this community. We are 100% funded by the TMST community. Support TMST, hear uncut interviews, and keep it ad-free: https://tmst.supercast.com/ Join our free online community (it’s not a Facebook group!): https://www.tmstpod.com/