A discussion on criminal justice reform with Rashawn Ray, a David M. Rubenstein Fellow in Governance Studies at Brookings, and Brent Orrell, a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, who led the Brookings-AEI Working Group on Criminal Justice Reform. The working group issued the report “A better path forward for criminal justice,” featuring essays by more than a dozen experts offering a range of research-grounded policy analysis and ideas to move the criminal justice system toward a more humane and effective footing. Also, Mark Muro, senior fellow in the Metropolitan Policy Program, offers his perspective on why the American Rescue Plan’s funding for state and local governments supports both innovative recovery solutions but also local discretion, as the case of Indiana demonstrates. Show notes and transcript:   Follow Brookings podcasts on Apple or Google podcasts, or on Spotify. Send feedback email to , and follow us and tweet us at  on Twitter. The Brookings Cafeteria is part of the .