In today's conversation, I am joined by Dr. Nick Epley, Director of the Center for Decision Research at the University of Chicago Booth School of Business. I was introduced to Nick by the amazing Ayelet Fishbach, who has been on The Brainy Business twice before.

Nick studies social cognition—how thinking people think about other thinking people—to understand why smart people so routinely misunderstand each other. He teaches an ethics and well-being course to MBA students called Designing a Good Life (sounds like a perfect fit around here, and we do talk about this in the episode). His research has appeared in more than two dozen empirical journals, been featured by the New York Times, Wall Street Journal, CNN, Wired, NPR, and more. 

As Nick will share with us today...you may not realize it, but you were born with an extraordinary ability to understand what others think, feel, believe, want, and know. You are a mind reader! It’s a sixth sense you use every day, in every personal and professional relationship you have. Today, Nick will share a bit of what scientists have learned about our ability to understand others and the surprising mistakes we so routinely make.

Show Notes:

• [00:45] In today's conversation, I am joined by Dr. Nick Epley, director of The Center of Decision Research at the University of Chicago, Booth School of Business. Nick studies social cognition.
• [02:52] You may not realize it, but you were born with an extraordinary ability to understand what others think, feel, believe, want, and know. You are a mind reader. 
• [05:02] Nick shares about himself and his background. He is a professor of behavioral science at the University of Chicago. 
• [07:32] There are systematic gaps between our beliefs about someone else and reality. If we can understand what those gaps are we can understand why they exist. 
• [09:38] The quality of our social relationships is a critical determinant of our happiness, probably the most important. Other people are the single biggest source of our happiness as well as our misery. 
• [11:55] One of the big barriers to people being more social in their daily lives is that they underestimate how social others are. 
• [13:35] We get that risk-reward trade-off with other people wrong. We think it is riskier to reach out and engage than it is. 
• [15:05] Failing to realize that other people are social is a barrier to us.
• [17:43] One of the common things we find is that people are often surprised at how much they learned, how enjoyable the conversation was, and how much they have in common with the other person. 
• [20:22] Conversations have a magnetic quality to them. It draws people together and surprises people. 
• [22:02] If you don’t like small talk…stop having it. When you take an interest in other people they reveal interesting stuff and take an interest in you. 
• [24:18] Take an interest in another person - that is how you have good conversations. 
• [26:26] If you care about somebody then you ask them questions that matter to them. Treat other people like they are good friends. 
• [28:09] When people imagine having a meaningful conversation with a stranger, they think the other person is not going to want to hear about it or care about it. When they get into it and open up to each other it generally goes way better than people expect. 
• [29:56] Having a culture where people are open, honest, and willing to engage and connect with one another, they feel connected to the place because they are connected to each other is the kind of culture that every organization wants to have and helps get the job done. 
• [31:56] People’s reluctance to reach out and engage with others is exactly the kind of barrier that organizations would want to get rid of. 
• [33:38] The things that basic psychology has to teach people in business is the same thing we have to teach people in their everyday lives.  
• [36:02] If you are bringing people into your organization, think about interviewing with your culture in mind. 
• [38:46] When you make connection activities routine, common, easy, and part of the habits so people aren’t thinking about it, you design it with the context so it just happens this way that is how they spread through organizations and you sustain them. 
• [41:30] Often organizations don’t choose to make these types of opportunities a priority.  
• [43:52] Typing and texting lack the emotion and the thinking behind those words that you get from a person’s voice. 
• [45:32] Share kind thoughts with other people. 
• [46:35] Think about somebody you feel grateful to and write them a note. Try to connect with a stranger.
• [49:17] Melina’s closing thoughts
• [50:36] Take the time for real human connections, even small ones each day and see what happens. 

Thanks for listening. Don’t forget to subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Android. If you like what you heard, please leave a review on iTunes and share what you liked about the show. 

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Check out and get your copies of Melina’s Books. 

Get the Books Mentioned on (or related to) this Episode:

• Mindwise, by Nick Epley
• Nudge, by Richard Thaler & Cass Sunstein
• Get It Done, by Ayelet Fishbach
• Both/And Thinking, by Wendy Smith & Marianne Lewis
• Happier Hour, by Cassie Holmes

Connect with Nick: 

• Nick’s Website

Top Recommended Next Episode: Vulnerability Loops (ep 229)

Already Heard That One? Try These: 

• Get It Done: Surprising Lessons from the Science of Motivation with Ayelet Fishbach (ep 186)
• How to Make 2023 Your Best Year Ever with Ayelet Fishbach and Cassie Holmes (ep 249)
• NUDGES & Choice Architecture (ep 35)
• Herding (ep 19) 
• Focusing Illusion (ep 89)
• The Brainy Benefits of Gratitude (ep 236)
• You Have More Influence Than You Think, Vanessa Bohns (ep 197)
• Both/And Thinking with Dr. Wendy Smith (ep 261)
• Herding (ep 19) 
• The Power of Us with Dr. Dominic Packer (ep 178)
• Using Behavioral Science to Build Connections, an interview with Jon Levy, author of You’re Invited (ep 150)
• Reciprocity: The Amazing Power of Giving (ep 238)
• Only 1% of People Blow the Whistle at Work—How to Fix That, with Nuala Walsh (ep 153)
• Habits (ep 256)

Other Important Links: 

• Brainy Bites - Melina’s LinkedIn Newsletter
• ssl.webflow.com/5c484e0f4aa6f839dc553c45/62705335abcc574d93d95150_1-s2.0-S1364661322000432-main.pdf"> Undersociality: miscalibrated social cognition can inhibit social connection
• life-talk-strangers.html"> Why Your Social Life Is Not What It Should Be
• for-help.html"> Go Ahead, Ask for Help. People Are Happy to Give It.
• you-notes.html">You Should Actually Send That Thank You Note You’ve Been Meaning to Write
• Small talk is boring. Our research shows how you can do better.
• acts-of-kindness.html"> The Unexpected Power of Random Acts of Kindness